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Post by Gene Hunt on Apr 4, 2014 20:40:46 GMT
Hi
I am interested in your definitions of 'object' and 'space' and how they relate to the size of the universe.
If space is the static distance that separates objects and there are only a finite amount of objects that constitute the universe what happens when we travel far enough in a given direction so that all objects are receding from us ? What would we move into ? Would we be creating our own 'space' as we go along and if so what is it that is still in front of us as we continue to travel ? Empty space ? But there are no objects in our path to define this space - only those that are behind us.
Now my head hurts. Goddamn you big questions! Is it finite, infinite or dynamic with some sort of 'nothingness' boundary ?
Hope you can see what I'm getting at - I am not a physicist btw just an interested layman with some science background.
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Post by nicholashesed on Apr 7, 2014 17:10:36 GMT
Hi I am interested in your definitions of 'object' and 'space' and how they relate to the size of the universe. If space is the static distance that separates objects and there are only a finite amount of objects that constitute the universe what happens when we travel far enough in a given direction so that all objects are receding from us ? What would we move into ? Would we be creating our own 'space' as we go along and if so what is it that is still in front of us as we continue to travel ? Empty space ? But there are no objects in our path to define this space - only those that are behind us. Now my head hurts. Goddamn you big questions! Is it finite, infinite or dynamic with some sort of 'nothingness' boundary ? Hope you can see what I'm getting at - I am not a physicist btw just an interested layman with some science background. Universe refers to concept. All concepts lack form, in other words are not objects. Thus universe could not possibly have the observer dependent, extrinsic property called size. Strictly speaking, one should not even use a definite article on universe as in 'The Universe'. Its just an abstract name nestling in all the objects of existence. Some ancient probably got sick of saying, "and all the trees and all the stars and all humans and all the mountains, etc." so he came up with the bright abstraction he named universe or cosmos.
With space, you have to realize that this is the most screwed notion in history. Space is just a concept, worked out by humans via brain. Space is that which lacks form. Space has no boundary, or bounds. Just an idea. The static distance that separates objects is a possible description of space but this can be misleading until one comes to understand that space is just a conceptual illusion. An object is NOT literally in space or moving through space. This would be an ontological contradiction. It is impossible to be in space or to perform a verb with space. These are all misnomers and misunderstandings used in ordinary language.
If you traveled far enough in a given direction so that all stars and galaxies recede, then in supposition you would still be connected to them. But this ties into EM Rope Hypothesis and Thread Theory. The only possible assumption is that all atoms are interconnected by the twined EM threads. Distance is really the length of an EM Rope connecting any two atoms.
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Post by Gene Hunt on Apr 8, 2014 20:11:53 GMT
Hi Nicholas, Thank you for the reply So what you are basically saying is that I should abandon the notion that space is some kind of physical medium through which objects move since space is essentially nothing and it makes no sense to talk of moving 'through' nothing ? Is that the essence of it ? And by the same logic time is also illusory - time doesn't 'flow' and you can't move 'through' it ? But if space is not 'physical' how did we end up with the notion of matter being able to 'bend' Iit thereby producing gravity ? Am I missing something here ? Please explain.
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Post by Gene Hunt on Apr 9, 2014 11:43:21 GMT
Hello again,
I’ve been looking into the EM rope hypothesis that you mention and I have a thought experiment that I would like to discuss.
Imagine if we have a transmitter, A, pointed directly at a receiver, B, which is located at least several light seconds away from the transmitter. We pulse the transmitter so as to send a light signal from A to B. Now, according to the hypothesis, the light signal (torque signal) begins it’s journey along the EM rope(s) connecting the atoms in the emitter to the atoms in the receiver. However, as soon as the signal has departed from A, we immediately position an opaque barrier between A and B. What will happen to the light signal ? will it continue its journey along the EM ropes connecting A to B, going through the barrier and hitting the detector (since the ropes freely interpenetrate all matter), or will the light impinge upon atoms in surface of the barrier, being absorbed or reflected - but if this is the case surely the signal would have had to ‘jump’ from the EM ropes connecting A and B, to the ropes connecting A to the barrier, or there is some type of ‘blending’ of the ropes once they become colinear?
Seen from the viewpoint of light as discrete particles (photons) or as an EM wave propagating through space one would conclude that the light would hit the barrier, never making it to the detector.
To keep it simple let us assume we are dealing with light from say the visible part of the spectrum, i.e. non-penetrating.
This is just one of the aspects that I’m having trouble wrapping my head around.
What are your thoughts ?
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Post by nicholashesed on Apr 9, 2014 12:56:48 GMT
Hi Nicholas, Thank you for the reply So what you are basically saying is that I should abandon the notion that space is some kind of physical medium through which objects move since space is essentially nothing and it makes no sense to talk of moving 'through' nothing ? Is that the essence of it ? And by the same logic time is also illusory - time doesn't 'flow' and you can't move 'through' it ? But if space is not 'physical' how did we end up with the notion of matter being able to 'bend' Iit thereby producing gravity ? Am I missing something here ? Please explain. Yes to your first set of questions.
As to the second that is getting involved with the study of gravity. What is missing is a rational, conceivable, possible objective physical medium of gravity. What object or set of objects collectively mediate gravity in a manner consistent with Newton's equations??? What is this physical medium's tie to the atom and to light phenomenon? That is the question that needs to be answered. An idea such as space cannot mediate phenomenon. Newton failed to suppose a medium. Einstein got confused.
For a quick rundown on how gravity works see: www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvWeYJg9Oxs&index=3&list=PL33137AC49185D66FThese videos explain the problems much better than I could in a little post. We have a lot of articles and diagrams in the Rational Science Network, floating around the internet. As a suggested reading, Gaede's Gravity Chapter in WGDE is IMHO some of the best physics ever written only matched by his work on light.
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Post by nicholashesed on Apr 10, 2014 1:36:11 GMT
Hello again, I’ve been looking into the EM rope hypothesis that you mention and I have a thought experiment that I would like to discuss. Imagine if we have a transmitter, A, pointed directly at a receiver, B, which is located at least several light seconds away from the transmitter. We pulse the transmitter so as to send a light signal from A to B. Now, according to the hypothesis, the light signal (torque signal) begins it’s journey along the EM rope(s) connecting the atoms in the emitter to the atoms in the receiver. However, as soon as the signal has departed from A, we immediately position an opaque barrier between A and B. What will happen to the light signal ? will it continue its journey along the EM ropes connecting A to B, going through the barrier and hitting the detector (since the ropes freely interpenetrate all matter), or will the light impinge upon atoms in surface of the barrier, being absorbed or reflected - but if this is the case surely the signal would have had to ‘jump’ from the EM ropes connecting A and B, to the ropes connecting A to the barrier, or there is some type of ‘blending’ of the ropes once they become colinear? Seen from the viewpoint of light as discrete particles (photons) or as an EM wave propagating through space one would conclude that the light would hit the barrier, never making it to the detector. To keep it simple let us assume we are dealing with light from say the visible part of the spectrum, i.e. non-penetrating. This is just one of the aspects that I’m having trouble wrapping my head around. What are your thoughts ? My thoughts would depend on the barrier. But your scenario is sort of similar to Young's Experiment and variations. Gaede does a variation of Young's Experiment using a needle. But yeah all the atoms of transmitter A, receiver B and barrier C are interconnected. A signal sent from A will induce the atoms of B and C. The protons or neutrons of the atoms comprising barrier C could possibly absorb and diffuse the signals sent from A to B. It depends on the barrier and the alignment of the atoms comprising the barrier with the EM Ropes connecting A and B at the time of placement in relation to the EM Rope connecting A and B. In supposition the signal could make it through pending the type of barrier and signal. On a thin sheet, like a foil they use at CERN the EM Rope could pass through an E shell or the EM Rope could oscillate around the Electric axles of C's protons or temporarily help constitute neutrons of C's atoms. Something similar happens when we face the Sun. All the atoms of the Sun are connected to all the atoms of the Universe. Not all the EM Ropes fork out on your body or Earth's body to form your atoms or Earth's atoms. Thus gazillions of signals pass right through you unimpeded. In mainstream they call these signals solar neutrinos, but they are really disturbances of EM Ropes that will end at stars light years away. A signal sent from the Sun to say Andromeda could very well pass through your body unimpeded and end on a star of Andromeda light years away. Mainstream is clueless about neutrinos because they have no possibly mediator of light and gravity. But the atoms of C will receive the signals sent from A by virtue of the assumption that they are already connected. Moving the barrier a little won't make any sort of difference. The signals sent from A will press the atoms of C. If the barrier is a needle then the atoms of C will relay the signals to all the atoms of the needle. The lateral atoms on the perimeter would relay signals to the atoms of B and if there is a backdrop there would appear fringes. And then we are getting into all the various architectures. You have to learn the form of the H atom and neutron. EM Ropes fork out to form the H atoms. M Threads arc out to constitute the Electron Shell E Threads crisscross to form the Proton Koosh (like in my avatar courtesy of CERN) Neutrons are a crisscrossing converging of EM Ropes that do not fork out. And yes there is convergence, mingling, superposition of EM Ropes. The common question asked is why don't the EM Ropes tangle or touch. They have the ability to pass through another similar without disturbance to form or motion. Just confirm this at home by passing two lasers or flashlight through each other. This is called light on light. Its been observed by many including Huygens and Maxwell (see quotes in the Red Shift thread). The quantum mechanics are aware of this unique behavior but they don't care anymore.
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Post by Gene Hunt on Apr 10, 2014 17:55:10 GMT
Hi there,
Hmm..I'm watching the vids on youtube right now. Very interesting so far, he does make some good points. Could it be that these EM ropes of yours posess the fundamental property we know as 'mass' at all times, but not the fundamental property we know as 'matter' - this latter property only emerges when the ropes bifurcate to form atoms ? With all these ropes criss-crossing space the 'mass' would be there - but not the matter - giving us...hey presto..Dark Matter ! Lol only kidding...
I'll watch the rest and get back to you with some questions, you're not off the hook yet !
Thnx for your replies.
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Post by nicholashesed on Apr 11, 2014 12:22:54 GMT
Hi there, Hmm..I'm watching the vids on youtube right now. Very interesting so far, he does make some good points. Could it be that these EM ropes of yours posess the fundamental property we know as 'mass' at all times, but not the fundamental property we know as 'matter' - this latter property only emerges when the ropes bifurcate to form atoms ? With all these ropes criss-crossing space the 'mass' would be there - but not the matter - giving us...hey presto..Dark Matter ! Lol only kidding... I'll watch the rest and get back to you with some questions, you're not off the hook yet ! Thnx for your replies. Hi Gene. No problem. Good to have you here! I enjoy this stuff. Yeah the EM Ropes solve some of the dark matter/energy 'problems'. Usually these are blown way out of proportion. Mainstream slipped in dark matter and dark energy into Big-Bang model as an ad hoc. As far as fundamental property, IMHO the only fundamental property conceivable is Form. All objects even the Thread have Form and this is innate, intrinsic, observer dependent. Form is Res Ipsa Loquens. I and others have articles written about the the supreme importance of Form in philosophy and physics. Matter is just an abstract concept. It could be defined as the set of objects, or as the two basic units: EM Ropes and H atoms. Mass is a conceptual property, but extrinsic, observer dependent. How could mass be a fundamental property when the relation relies on observations? But its definition and use vary with context. Usually mainstream is devious with its use of the word 'mass'. Its a 'god' word. If you get into RH & TT, Gaede has some awesome insights into mass in context to Newton's equations, e.g. M1 * m2 represents the number EM connections between two objects, for example the Sun and the Earth. Or mass is the radial tension mediated by atoms opposite the pull local gravity. Gaede broke into the mysteries of Mach's Principle and Einstein's principle of Equivalence. Interesting stuff. But I basically understood what you meant.
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Post by Gene Hunt on Apr 15, 2014 19:40:53 GMT
Hi there! I'm back from my foray into the rope hypothesis. So I have a few questions 1. How does friction between the E and M threads at the point of bifurcation generate charge, let alone a charge which must be equal and opposite to the charge at the nucleus (convergence of E threads) to maintain an electrically neutral atom ? Isn't change generation by friction a macroscopic effect caused by transfer of electrons from one body to another eg balloon rubbed with fur brush. I don't see how it applies here. 2. The principle of ray reversibility. This got me totally confused! I can see how it would work with the emitter/receiver and reflector stationary relative to each other but when motion is involved - like with the laser and moon reflector - I lose it. For a 2 sec round trip I can see the argument that the signal returns along the EM rope connecting transmitter to reflector, but If the reflector were instead 6 light hours away the earth would have rotated 180 degrees and be facing away from the reflector once the light signal made it back - how could it ever hit the receiver without bending ? Or going through the planet on the EM rope ? Have I got hold of the wrong end of the stick here ? 3. Have you attempted to model more complex atoms (or molecules) and account for valency ? 4. How would you explain nuclear spin (or lack of spin for many elements) and NMR - here we see quantisation and discrete energy levels for the nucleus - not the electrons (or magnetic shell in the hypothesis). Although I have many more questions and observations I do not want to burden you with having to write lengthy replies. I will try more research. I agree with the RSM opinion of mathematical physics though - which is how I stumbled across the RSM group in the first place. I've grown quite skeptical of late about some of the theories and 'evidence' for those theories which are being force fed to the public. Time travel, parallel universes, worm holes, ten, no wait..eleven dimensions, dark energy etc belong on the sci-fi channel, not discovery. So that got me thinking just how much of what we have already been fed as fact (Big Bang, black holes, expanding space etc.) is actually far from it. Just how irrefutable is the evidence ? You are yet to sell me on the RH but as for your views in general I can relate to those. Thnx 4 the replies.
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Post by nicholashesed on Apr 17, 2014 18:08:03 GMT
Its all good Gene! I'm glad you have seen through mainstream/majority opinions. The same sort of thing happened with me. I really felt I got played the fool.
I don't mean to sound like I'm selling a hypothesis/theory. I'm just become very forward and accustomed to it. They say one is never suppose to fall in love with a theory, but I guess I have a little.
A couple of your questions are easily answered. A couple not as easily answered. I will get back to you in a week or two. I'm very busy now in real life.
But nothing I write can match the sort of depth Gaede goes into in his book. And I might add that if one gets into this hypothesis and theory one will have to start thinking a little differently in terms of physics. This is not your run of the mill theory. It takes a little commitment. There are also philosophical issues we've been working on. And I might add that Gaede did not answer all questions in his book. His hypothesis and theory have been applied to various problems at RSM, Rope Hypothesis or my group, Nuclear Physics under EM Rope Hypothesis and Thread on Facebook. This stuff is still more or less in its infancy. But it seems to me to be rational and have a lot of potential. I saw that right from the start.
But the fundamental assumption is that all the atoms of the U are connected. That is probably the most radical and revolutionary idea put on the table and the most important.
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Post by Gene Hunt on Apr 17, 2014 20:33:10 GMT
Hi Nicholas, I agree, the idea of a mediator between all atoms is what I find most appealing about the hypothesis. I was bred on the quantum mechanical view of the atom - the wave equation, atomic orbitals, molecular orbital theory, sigma bonds, pi bonds etc so am most interested to see how the RH compares with these models - hence my many questions. But I understand it is still early days for the RH and many fine details remain to be worked out. I look forward to further developments
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Post by nicholashesed on May 19, 2014 17:58:38 GMT
Hi Nicholas, I agree, the idea of a mediator between all atoms is what I find most appealing about the hypothesis. I was bred on the quantum mechanical view of the atom - the wave equation, atomic orbitals, molecular orbital theory, sigma bonds, pi bonds etc so am most interested to see how the RH compares with these models - hence my many questions. But I understand it is still early days for the RH and many fine details remain to be worked out. I look forward to further developments Hi Gene, I'm sorry I've neglected our conversation. I was busy with life, then I got into an epic alpha mode of brainstorming about chemical bonds and ionization. My sketches and thoughts are all up on my facebook group or blog. If you are on facebook feel free to join. Its called Nuclear Physics Under EM Rope Hypothesis and Thread Theory. www.facebook.com/groups/442708405857037/We could work through problems there if you want. I have a lot more stuff planned too. There is a little more activity there and its easier just to post thoughts in a quick manner.
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